What Happened To The Poacher? 12/4 results added

[Nighthawk]

It’s the choice of the prosecutor and the CO that  signed the complaints if they want to offer any type of deal. There is an abundance of evidence here that points to this guy being guilty.   If I personally signed the complaints there would be no offer on the table.  There is plenty of evidence that I would feel confident in taking it to trial.  

[hunterbob1]

11 minutes ago, thefirstndsecond said:

Why should the poacher be penalized in all 50 states?

Same reasoning as a convicted pedafile,geography doesn't change there stripe's!

25 minutes ago, thefirstndsecond said:

Can you imagine if hunting were a right? Remember this was supposed to happen years ago?

And how did that work out?

 

https://www.americanheritage.com/return-white-tailed-deer

[BowhunterNJ]

I don't think there's any room for a "not guilty" here...there is no cognizant and clear minded person who could not render a guilty verdict here at trial.  The guy literally has no excuse to lean on.  Didn't know the season dates?  Didn't know he couldn't hunt there?  Didn't know what he was doing was wrong?

Why are you cutting the head off?
Why aren't you dragging the whole deer out?
Why are you hiding when someone encounters you if you're there legally?

[Haskell_Hunter]

18 minutes ago, BowhunterNJ said:

I don't think that's very fair.  It's just a pay to play (or avoid) platform.  Absolutely everyone should be afforded the opportunity to plead their case in the event they are innocent or did not commit the level of crime they are being accused of, but in the face of irrefutable facts with clear intent to commit an exact crime (as is the case with this poacher), no one should be able to plea down and "negotiate".  That simply defeats the purpose of the legal system and having penalties fit crimes.

Listen, I'm all for forgiveness and recognizing people are only human, make mistakes, and commit both intentional and unintentional crimes.  No one is infallible, but there still needs to be accountability and the penalty should fit the intended crime.  At most you plea down when you have unintentionally committed a crime.  This wasn't a lapse of judgement or an unintentional mistake, the intention was very clear and an act of "How can I shoot this buck on a property I'm not supposed to be on before the season opens so no one else gets it before I do?".  

See the bold and underlined part.  That's what we call "evidence".  It should be evaluated regardless of how irrefutable and fact-like it may be.  This is why it is fair.  The accused must have their day in court to refute the accusations imposed upon them.

My federal case that I just agreed to a confidential settlement in had "irrefutable facts" against me.  We never got through the discovery phase of the trial because I started tearing into those "irrefutable facts".

I understand that the poacher was caught and there is a lot of evidence against him.  He is still entitled to his day in court and an opportunity to argue his innocence.  It is the responsibility of the state to present the case against him and advocate for a penalty.  Courts generally prefer quick settlements versus lengthy trials.

[BowhunterNJ]

Agreed, he is entitled to his defense.  I don't know what it would be, but I also don't think him bogging the court down in a lengthy trail should be a reason to cut him a deal (even if that is what happens out of preference).

His defenses:

1. Didn't know the season dates
2. Didn't know he couldn't hunt there
3. Any others?

Are any of those credible in combination with the remainder of the facts (hiding from being discovered, cutting the head off the deer, leaving the rest of the body to wonton waste, etc)?

Just curious how this guy could even be successfully defended...you know his lawyers are already going through all the scenarios.

[hunterbob1]

Never forgot hearing this as a Ute.Ignorance is no excuse for breaking the law.I'd love to see him in front of Judge Judy,she'd give it to him where the sun don't shine.

[mfried]

39 minutes ago, Lunatic said:

two weeks in this case. No September season in this zone

zone 6 is where this deer was taken. opening day is Sept 14th. 

[Lunatic]

5 minutes ago, mfried said:

zone 6 is where this deer was taken. opening day is Sept 14th. 

Don't know which zone he was in. The article stated there was no EAB season in this area so it did not start on the 14th

Edited October 21, 2019 by Lunatic

[Lunatic]

8 minutes ago, Lunatic said:

Don't know which zone he was in. The article stated there was no EAB season in this area so it did not start on the 14th

It was not the article. The guy who caught him wrote:

Quote

nb6624

Y Buck

 

NJW&W Members

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Posted September 9

UPDATE:   Poacher identified as Joseph Ciottariello of Rockaway, NJ

Unfortunately i didnt kill it, but my Spartan camera caught a total scumbag illegally poaching and cutting his head off!

So the back story,,ive been watching this giant since last season and have been getting great pics of him all summer. As i was out shooting my bow i got a picture on my camera of deer legs..i was sure what to make of it..but the next picture confirmed a low life trespassing in camo and crossbow. So i notified fish and wildlife and they met me at the property.  We walked in and caught the poacher red handed as he was cutting the head off this magnificent buck. The rest will be public information when he has his day in court. I hope this story spreads like wildfire and this creep is publicly humiliated.  And as a lesson to other poachers that are out there doing the same thing. I was planning on filming my hunt and now this total dirtbag killed him 3 weeks early. What waste and an insult to the sport.

 

[mfried]

59 minutes ago, Lunatic said:

two weeks in this case. No September season in this zone

zone 6 is where this deer was taken.

 

7 minutes ago, Lunatic said:

It was not the article. The guy who caught him wrote:

 

it wouldnt surprise me if the exact location has been muddied, But this was taken in Hopatcong, which is entirely in zone 6, which is EAB. I would have no way to know if someone else in this post is not telling the story straight, but nothing surprises me in Hopatcong.  All people do is jack deer there, its been that way for 40 years.

 

im not saying the OP is incorrect, im sure hes being honest about this, but there were probably 5 other guys who were gonna jack that deer somewhere in that place.  If it happened it where i think im surprised it didnt get shot with a .22.

Edited October 21, 2019 by mfried
adding

[Nighthawk]

The lawyer is going to do what ever his client wants. That’s how they make their money.  At the end of the day he will most likely be found guilty.  This will all take place in municipal court.  We as ethical hunters feel the book should be thrown at him but in reality it’s going to be some BS fine and possibly a loss of license.  

[rgw]

My guess is loss of license and big fine. Should go to jail but won't. Maybe make him write an apology like the bear guy for the compendium

[Bucndoe]

15 minutes ago, mfried said:

zone 6 is where this deer was taken.

 

it wouldnt surprise me if the exact location has been muddied, But this was taken in Hopatcong, which is entirely in zone 6, which is EAB. I would have no way to know if someone else in this post is not telling the story straight, but nothing surprises me in Hopatcong.  All people do is jack deer there, its been that way for 40 years.

 

im not saying the OP is incorrect, im sure hes being honest about this, but there were probably 5 other guys who were gonna jack that deer somewhere in that place.  If it happened it where i think im surprised it didnt get shot with a .22.

The story posted here and all info by the OP is solid. Your opinion is just that, an opinion and not a fact that is relevant

[mfried]

5 minutes ago, Bucndoe said:

The story posted here and all info by the OP is solid. Your opinion is just that, an opinion and not a fact that is relevant

what do you mean? it wasnt shot in zone 6? 

 

literally says it right here, shot in Hopatcong, season starts the 14th. 

 

https://www.njherald.com/news/20190926/trail-cam-captures-out-of-season-hunter

Edited October 21, 2019 by mfried

[mazzgolf]

From the news article:

Quote

Ciottariello was issued summonses for taking a deer during the closed season; failure to tag immediately upon harvest; failture (sp) to register by 8 p.m. on the date of harvest; wanton waste of deer; and failure to exhibit a valid hunting license upon request.

Based on that, we already know what his maximum sentence will be. I'll assume its a first -offense.

* Failure to register on date of harvest ($100 up to $500)
* Taking deer during the closed season ($100 up to $500)
* Failure to tag immediately upon harvest ($100 up to $500)

Quote

 

23:4-48.  Penalties

    Except as otherwise specifically permitted by this article:  any person hunting for, pursuing, shooting at, taking, killing, wounding, having in possession in this State or attempting to take, kill or wound a deer of any description other than as permitted by the State Fish and Game Code, hunting for, pursuing, shooting at, taking, killing, wounding, having in possession in this State or attempting to take, kill, wound or possess any wild deer at any time, except during the period designated therefor by the State Fish and Game Code, or in the absence of such provision in said code, except during the period designated therefor in this article;  or killing in any one year more than the number of deer permitted by the State Fish and Game Code, or hunting for, pursuing, stalking or shooting at a wild deer, except by daylight on the days designated therefor by the State Fish and Game Code, or killing a deer in this State at any time and failing to report the same in the manner prescribed by the division, or killing a deer in this State at any time and failing to properly tag and transport the deer to a checking station for registration as provided in R.S. 23:4-47, or using or carrying a rifle of any kind or description for the purpose of hunting or pursuing deer, or violating any of the other provisions of this article or of the Fish and Game Code promulgated thereunder, or violating any other provisions of this Title or the Fish and Game Code pertaining to the taking of deer of either sex, shall be liable to a penalty of not less than $100.00 nor more than $500.00 for the first offense and not less than $300.00 nor more than $1,000.00 for the second and each subsequent offense.

 

 

* Wanton waste of deer (I can't find the penalty for violating this admin code - I'll assume its at least $100)

Quote

 

N.J.A.C. § 7:25-5.22 (h)(2)

It is unlawful for any person to take, kill, or capture any game mammal or game bird and remove from the carcass the head, hide, or antlers and leave the edible portions of the carcass and meat to waste

 

 

* Failure to exhibit a valid hunting license upon request ($100 up to $300):

Quote

23:3-56.2.  Possession, transfer and display of license;  violations; penalty
    Any person, including members of the armed services, who shall hunt for, pursue, shoot at, take, kill or wound, or attempt to take, kill or wound a deer  as permitted by this section or the State Fish and Game Code, without having a  license as herein prescribed on his person and displayed in a conspicuous place  on his outer clothing, or who alters or changes in any manner, or loans or  transfers to another a license issued under this act, or violates any other  provision of this act, or any regulation established under the State Fish and  Game Code in connection herewith, shall be liable to a penalty of not less than  $100.00 nor more than $300.00 for the first offense, and not less than $300.00  nor more than $500.00 for the second and subsequent offense.

 

So all total, it will be about a minimum of $500 and maximum of around $2,000 give or take.

No jail time involved in any of these violations.

There is a potential for loss of license (and if you lose your license in NJ, you lose it in pretty much all of the US due to the Wildlife Violator's Compact).

I didn't see the provision that talks about loss of license - it could be that is only a "second time offense" penalty. So I can't say if a first-time offender will lose his license or not. So unless someone finds the penalty that states loss of license on first offense of these laws, its possible someone guilty of these charges can still keep his hunting license, but again, I do not know because I couldn't find it.