H.R.38 - Concealed Carry Reciprocity Act of 2017

[Cyanide02Z06]

Passed the committee yesterday, now we wait for Paul Ryan to put it up for a vote in Congress.

 

Full text of bill attached:

BILLS-115hr38ih.pdf

Edited November 30, 2017 by Cyanide02Z06

[sicrado]

Does this have any traction?

[GhostBear]

Interesting read, it the first paragraph it state that a resident CCW holder, that says to me it will render non res cards moot. So We as NJ commoners are still without rights, next it says further down under " documentation" that there would be a federal card for CCW, will that then supersede the state? If so, then that's the only way we as law abiding citizens will be allowed to carry here.

[Bucksnbows]

Interesting read, it the first paragraph it state that a resident CCW holder, that says to me it will render non res cards moot. So We as NJ commoners are still without rights, next it says further down under " documentation" that there would be a federal card for CCW, will that then supersede the state? If so, then that's the only way we as law abiding citizens will be allowed to carry here.

 

I'm personally not sure of the minute details, but I very strongly fall on the state's rights side of the equation.  However, in this case, our state and a few others are too stupid to be allowed to cut law abiding citizens off from concealed carry and I support any federal effort that would change that.  But normally, I would not want to see Big Government (feds) take over the rights that states should give out.  This is clearly an exception that all legal gun owners should push for.   

Edited November 30, 2017 by Bucksnbows

[GhostBear]

Well I still don't know why Nj's justifiable need clause wasn't challenged yet? Even that crap hole CA ruled II unconstitutional, yet here we are still having to prove a vague "need" to exercise a federally protected RIGHT!! Lol, it a ban plain and simple.

[stratocaster]

I'm personally not sure of the minute details, but I very strongly fall on the state's rights side of the equation.  However, in this case, our state and a few others are too stupid to be allowed to cut law abiding citizens off from concealed carry and I support any federal effort that would change that.  But normally, I would not want to see Big Government (feds) take over the rights that states should give out.  This is clearly an exception that all legal gun owners should push for.   

You are arguing for and against states rights at the same time.  The purpose of the federal gov't is to enforce the law of the land which is the constitution.  If NJ democrats had their way,  all guns would be registered, we would have to take out insurance, pay a yearly ownership fee etc...the only way to control a rogue state like NJ is the federal gov't and SCOTUS. 

 

 The same point can be argued about the out of control EPA which has no constitutional authority but uses the power they were given by congress to tyranically control what a person can do with their own land That's why small and limited gov't is the only and best way to ensure liberty for all.   A lot of people make money from more complex regulations and an uninformed public doesn't understand how damaging it is to freedom until they experience it themselves and then it's too late. 99% of people don't even know how many amendments there are in the Bill of Rights or what they are. 

The only way to stop this BS is through SCOTUS and a strict interpretation of the constitution. 

[GhostBear]

Doesn't matter anyway,, it'll never get out of the house, they need 60 votes to pass it, repubs hold only 52 seats, and you know as well as I do this will run down party lines, that's how it got out of comity. 19-11.

[VAPPAC]

 

to provide a means by which nonresidents of a State whose residents may carry concealed firearms may also do so in the State.

That is then opening line intending to describe the bill.

 

We still would not be able to carry here in NJ because the residents here do not have the privilege of doing so.

This would make no change for those of us that live here and want to carry.

 

Taking it further - I still do not think it allows "non-residents" to carry here legally, because NJ residents are not allowed to. Unless I am missing something - I am not getting my hopes up at all, as I do not think this will change things one bit.

Edited November 30, 2017 by VAPPAC

[Haskell_Hunter]

Interesting read, it the first paragraph it state that a resident CCW holder, that says to me it will render non res cards moot. So We as NJ commoners are still without rights, next it says further down under " documentation" that there would be a federal card for CCW, will that then supersede the state? If so, then that's the only way we as law abiding citizens will be allowed to carry here.

 

 

That is then opening line intending to describe the bill.

 

We still would not be able to carry here in NJ because the residents here do not have the privilege of doing so.

This would make no change for those of us that live here and want to carry.

 

Taking it further - I still do not think it allows "non-residents" to carry here legally, because NJ residents are not allowed to. Unless I am missing something - I am not getting my hopes up at all, as I do not think this will change things one bit.

 

 

It does allow non-resident permit holders to carry within their own states.  The NJ2AS went to Washington to discuss this with bill sponsors.  They got the wording changed to do just that.  It's one of the reasons why I got UT, FL, and NH non-resident permits.  When this passes, I can carry in NJ.

[newjerseyhunter]

I'm personally not sure of the minute details, but I very strongly fall on the state's rights side of the equation.  However, in this case, our state and a few others are too stupid to be allowed to cut law abiding citizens off from concealed carry and I support any federal effort that would change that.  But normally, I would not want to see Big Government (feds) take over the rights that states should give out.  This is clearly an exception that all legal gun owners should push for.   

 

I'm not sure I understand your analysis. How could this be a "state's rights" issue when it is a Constitutional issue at heart? States should not be able to come up with their own interpretation of any Constitutional Amendment. That should be dictated by the Federal Government and SCOTUS if necessary. 

[Haskell_Hunter]

From the text:

 

 

and who is carrying a valid license or permit which is issued pursuant to the law of a State and which permits the person to carry a concealed firearm or is entitled to carry a concealed firearm in the State in which the person resides, may possess or carry a concealed handgun

 

The "or" was added to accommodate non-resident carry permits to be used in your own state or others.

[Cyanide02Z06]

If this passes and you have a non-resident concealed carry from another state, you would be able to carry in NJ.

[GhostBear]

Oh boy, that'll be grounds for appeal, another states law superseding another's? Jersey does not issue, they also do not honor other states permits. Jersey will tie this up in the courts forever, even if it does see the light of day. Lol

[Haskell_Hunter]

Oh boy, that'll be grounds for appeal, another states law superseding another's? Jersey does not issue, they also do not honor other states permits. Jersey will tie this up in the courts forever, even if it does see the light of day. Lol

 

NJ won't be able to stop it.  2A is federal jurisdiction.

 

The reason your driver's license is recognized by other states is due to CFR 49, a federal regulation.  This would also be a federal regulation and align perfectly with the powers given to the federal government.

 

Every blue state will try to fight this, but they're going to lose.  Whining is not a legal argument.

[GhostBear]

2A is fed, but it's been left to the states to implement, I.e. Make it as easy or as difficult as they want. States rights still play, every state, even NJ has a mechanism for gaining a permit as is required, NJ is structured so that nearly none are granted but enough so as not to technically infringe, now the fed is coming in and saying yeah after 200 plus years we want you to do it this way? Still why force NJ to honor an out of state permit?, why not push for a national CCW permit, granted by the Feds? This will take it out of the states hands without any ambiguity. Or a measure stating these are the means by which all states will issue CCWs without exception. As I read the bill there is much the blue states can challenge, but it's a moot point since it'll never clear the house anyway.