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Let me recap this for you beings you dont understand.

 

" There are hunters out there that can shoot a 6-8 inch group ar 20-30 yrds an that is good enough, Some other people I know that is not good enough and they always want better..There are lots of products out there that are good enough," ( Just Hunt )

 

" Well, if i'm understanding what you wrote correctly, you seem to suggest those of us who consistently use Montec broadheads, or perhaps another brand,  tend to shoot 6-8 inch groups at 20-30 yards." ( Axiom )

 

Nowhere did I say or suggest imply people who use Montecs or any other products only 6-8 inch groups, I said " There are hunters out there", I never specified equipment only their practice..

 

" You further seem to suggest  we who are satisfied with the performance of our chosen weaponry tend to accept any short comings we may have with regards to our shooting accuracy.." ( Axiom )

 

I never said they were short comings, I dont know the level of accuracy the shooter has with his equipment unless I see it or get some type of review..

 

" I disagree. I don't see how choice of arrow head relates to ones desire to stay on top of or improve his game in that regard.." ( Axiom )

 

You dont see how?.. :shock:   With increasing technology there are better designs in heads or even field points along with inserts/ outsets and or nocks,  Some heads without Oring technology or some thing similar will likely never sit concentric in the insert and be off by maybe .002  or the over all length / weight of the  head changes the overall dynamics of arrow flight.. There is a lot in deciding on what head or field point can be to better accuracy / KE just like there are different type of arrows, better tolerances , better lift capability of vanes, Some with more energy at longer yardages, Some prefer a larger dia arrow for 3D while others like a nano or X Impact for field, others might like running heavier point weight up front for spot etc,  all to stay on top or to improve their game.. If you dont see how, Than you just dont know much about arrows or components an the accuracy potential that can be offered...

 

" But I think its rather  impetuous of you to suggest those who are willing to try it are somehow or another better archers than those who don't... :whatever: " ( Axiom )

 

Again,Nowhere did I say those who try this product are a better archer.. My point through is there are some who want to be on top of the what may be leading technology an that is with any equipment.. Some Shooters are not as serious about performance as others or they just like what they have and choose not to further their potential.

 

I hope I cleared things up a bit, If you have any questions regarding Tramahawk I'll do my best to get info or help how I can, but otherwise the circulatory debating I dont have time for and your comments just seem be rather argumentative with moot points, whether you use Montecs or not is of no concern to me.. The Topic is the tramahawk, perhaps one day you could stop in the shop when I get some Tramahawks in an shoot one, be sure to bring your Montecs for a side by side... :up:

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Let me recap this for you beings you dont understand.

 

 

 

well, i'm not so sure I don't understand but..ok... :whistling:

 

Nowhere did I say or suggest imply people who use Montecs or any other products only 6-8 inch groups, I said " There are hunters out there",

 

 

Oh you said a little more than " there are hunters out there".. But any way....

 

I never specified equipment only their practice..

 

 

  well, you haven't specified equipment yet but there is more to come...

 

 

I never said they were short comings, I dont know the level of accuracy the shooter has with his equipment unless I see it or get some type of review..

 

You don't think shooting 6-8 inch groups at 20-30 yards is a short coming?.. How many archers do you think would agree with you on that?

 

 

You dont see how?.. :shock:   With increasing technology there are better designs in heads or even field points along with inserts/ outsets and or nocks,  Some heads without Oring technology or some thing similar will likely never sit concentric in the insert and be off by maybe .002  or the over all length / weight of the  head changes the overall dynamics of arrow flight.. There is a lot in deciding on what head or field point can be to better accuracy / KE just like there are different type of arrows, better tolerances , better lift capability of vanes, Some with more energy at longer yardages, Some prefer a larger dia arrow for 3D while others like a nano or X Impact for field, others might like running heavier point weight up front for spot etc,  all to stay on top or to improve their game.. If you dont see how, Than you just dont know much about arrows or components an the accuracy potential that can be offered...

 

That entire paragraph was purely subjective at best.. Further more you seem to suggest different projectile set ups are a matter of personal preference rather than a marked improvement over another product.. This I agree with.. Certainly new technology may seem to improve on some aspects of archery, but then again, if you are splitting arrows at "20-30" yards with old out dated equipment, who cares about the new stuff.. and WHY should someone care?.. to stay on top or improve their game?.. when you are hitting a bullseye every time with whatever setup you have, what is there to improve on?..

 

 

Again,Nowhere did I say those who try this product are a better archer...

 

 well if one can read between the lines I think its fair to say it was at least implied.. An apology may be in order here..

 

My point through is there are some who want to be on top of the what may be leading technology an that is with any equipment.. Some Shooters are not as serious about performance as others or they just like what they have and choose not to further their potential.

 

 

I think we really need to talk about what exactly is meant by "performance".. what do you mean?..  All I know is if I can put a hole in the middle of a dime at say 50 yards using arrows made by the cave man 10,000 years ago, what do I have to gain from "staying on top of technology"?.. And again, why would you suggest or "imply" the better archers or more attuned to newer technology?.. seems to me the techno geeks aren't doing anything other than looking for an arrow that will hit its target even if you shoot the bow in the opposite direction.. is that what you call "improving" your game?

 

 

I hope I cleared things up a bit

 

Oh you sure did. Im convinced now more than ever you see archers as either the amateurs who stick with what the know works, or the techno professionals who wont be happy till they have an arrow that will hit its target every time without having to aim..  But, that's ok.. I mean, not all of us have time to practice so having equipment that thinks for itself may be of some use to some people.. Like I said before, to each his own..

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" well, i'm not so sure I don't understand but..ok..." ( Axiom)

 

You dont and I not sure you ever will at this point with your circular logic..

 

" Oh you said a little more than " there are hunters out there".. But any way...."  ( Axiom )

 

Did you just give a fallacious rant?

 

" well, you haven't specified equipment yet but there is more to come..." ( Axiom )

 

Grasping for a few straws , hey...

 

" well if one can read between the lines I think its fair to say it was at least implied.. An apology may be in order here " ( Axiom )

 

An apology is in order, also due to the fact that you are trying to put your words in my mouth ( being a liar ) as I already have pointed out.. Does that help you continue in your fallacy of tautologies? 

 

" I think we really need to talk about what exactly is meant by "performance".. what do you mean?..All I know is if I can put a hole in the middle of a dime at say 50 yards using arrows made by the cave man 10,000 years ago, what do I have to gain from "staying on top of technology " ( Axiom )

 

This has to be your most contradictory statement, Please tell me why you use Montec and not a broad head made out of stone, Are your Montec's affix to wooden arrows shot out of your wooden bow, Do you have any videos of you shooting holes in dimes at 50 yrds with arrows made by cavemen, so I know your comment wasn't just another complete  fallacy...And do you shoot against Levi Morgan and or other pro archers? if you can hit dimes  excuse me ' put holes in dimes at 50 yrds " than you should pick up the phone right now an call company's like Elite or PSE if you're not already a pro shooter.. ;)

 

 

" And again, why would you suggest or "imply" the better archers or more attuned to newer technology?.. seems to me the techno geeks aren't doing anything other than looking for an arrow that will hit its target even if you shoot the bow in the opposite direction.. is that what you call "improving" your game? " ( Axiom )

 

Some better archers are attuned to new technology while some are traditional shooters , but more than likely you will try an twist this comment like others to support your argumentative agenda..., It depends how you look at it, Was Levi Morgan using the same relase he shot 10 yrs ago or does he recommend changing up, does Tim Mulligan  prefer  4 fletch Van'tec vane just cause he thinks its cool or should everyone be satisfied with buying a diamond infinite edge with whisker biscuit rest and shoot 6 inch groups at 20 yrds.... To each is there own, but I cannot put a guy who shoots an 8 inch group at 30 yrds on the same page as a Dan McCarthy who has seen his share of the podium..

 

 

" Oh you sure did. Im convinced now more than ever you see archers as either the amateurs who stick with what the know works, or the techno professionals who wont be happy till they have an arrow that will hit its target every time without having to aim.. " ( Axiom )

 

There you go again bearing false witness about me, do you always put words in people moths or am I special? I dont recall saying that everyone who sticks with what works is an amateur...Did anyone mention anything about not having to aim an arrow, no...Are you sounding a complete fool at this point bringing up pointless exaggerations, yes. Is your next comment going to mention hanging a tree stand from the space station?? And I guess you can call some techno professional, never heard that term before sounds high tec.. I just like to think of it as there are some hunters who want high end , higher performance products, if a cave man is happy with his set up, I'm not knocking him, but if he wants to upgrade from his wooden arrow to carbon with all Firenock components I can help.. Heck I can even help set him up in traditional equipment..

 

" I mean, not all of us have time to practice so having equipment that thinks for itself may be of some use to some people.. Like I said before, to each his own.." ( Axiom )

 

If someone doesn't have time to practice I sure hope they dont go hunting with any equipment. " Equipment thinks for itself " you are taking building a mountain out of an anthill to a whole new level...lol! , I was just saying there is better stuff out there with better tolerances, didnt you catch what I brought up in my comment? And nothing personal about me saying you dont know much about arrows or the components... .. 

 

( " Some heads without Oring technology or some thing similar will likely never sit concentric in the insert and be off by maybe .002  or the over all length / weight of the  head changes the overall dynamics of arrow flight.. There is a lot in deciding on what head or field point can be to better accuracy / KE just like there are different type of arrows, better tolerances , better lift capability of vanes, Some with more energy at longer yardages, Some prefer a larger dia arrow for 3D while others like a nano or X Impact for field, others might like running heavier point weight up front for spot etc,  all to stay on top or to improve their game.. If you dont see how, Than you just dont know much about arrows or components an the accuracy potential that can be offered.., ( Just Hunt )

 

You make it seem as if we have missile arming technology , wait I take that back,, Firenock does have that in their lighted nocks, but you still have to aim if that makes you feel better..lol!

 

 

You want to go raise an issue go say something to the bow company's for making better bows than they did last year, if you do that let me know how you make out, be sure to send me a link if possible.. I could use a few laughs, not that some of your fuzzy logic hasn't been funny its the only reason I really responded to comments that didnt warrant one.. :popcorn:

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Edited by Just Hunt
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