Is it me......

[Lunatic]

On 11/3/2019 at 11:51 AM, megavites said:

No, I'm a gun hunter as well 6-day, permit shotgun. All I'm saying is if we ended sometime in Jan. and had less tags we could increase the age structure of antlered deer.

That's good that your a selective hunter and I practice the same. I've seen what reduced tags and antler restrictions can do in PA.

We're afforded alot of huntable public land in NJ....and I wish everyone a mature buck on their wall. 

If you restrict tags to preserve deer herd then why do you need time restriction. If guy has two buck tags it makes no difference when he kills them. 

[JHbowhunter]

39 minutes ago, Lunatic said:

Do you think if all does were bred in one day bucks would just stop looking for receptive does? I don’t think so. They would be running and looking for a month straight with nothing to show for. When they find receptive they slow down. That’s why having  slightly higher ratio results in less stress for bucks 

agree 1:1 ain’t happening 

The rut stops when all the does are bred (or so I thought)  A buck can breed a doe pretty much all year around, just like we gender-typical heterosexual male humans can breed a gender-typical, heterosexual female every month of the year.   1 to 1 ratio would absolutely shorten the rut and does that were not bred would not come into a secondary estrous because they all were bred in November. 

[megavites]

2 hours ago, Lunatic said:

If you restrict tags to preserve deer herd then why do you need time restriction. If guy has two buck tags it makes no difference when he kills them. 

Actually, I like Bucky's suggestion better.

On 11/3/2019 at 12:43 PM, bucky said:

Just food for thought...1 buck with bow until shotgun opener then 1 buck your choice shotgun, bow or muzzle loader, instead of killing two bucks with great genetics before they have a chance to spread their seed and also gives others a fair opportunity to take a nice buck

[Lunatic]

19 hours ago, JHbowhunter said:

The rut stops when all the does are bred (or so I thought)  A buck can breed a doe pretty much all year around, just like we gender-typical heterosexual male humans can breed a gender-typical, heterosexual female every month of the year.   1 to 1 ratio would absolutely shorten the rut and does that were not bred would not come into a secondary estrous because they all were bred in November. 

I am not a biologist and I have to admit not well read on this subject but I believe if there was no fertile does in the area buck would still chase, looking for receptive doe in October/November because this is their time to reproduce. I think every one of them would be looking. This is what a they do, nose to the ground and checking every single doe encountered. You are assuming they chase because they get a scent of doe in heat. I think they chase to find one. That’s why I don’t think 1:1 would work well 

Edited November 6, 2019 by Lunatic

[JHbowhunter]

33 minutes ago, Lunatic said:

I am not a biologist and I have to admit not well read on this subject but I believe if there was no fertile does in the area buck would still chase, looking for receptive doe in October/November because this is their time to reproduce. I think every one of them would be looking. This is what a they do, nose to the ground and checking every single doe encountered. You are assuming they chase because they get a scent of doe in heat. I think they chase to find one. That’s why I don’t think 1:1 would work well 

I punt that one to Rusty. I thought I read that does drive the rut the bucks just respond accordingly. Put 20 bucks  in a 250 acre high fence with zero exposure to females. Not a whiff.  My theory is they would not make scrapes  and only rub to remove velvet. No fighting.  Nothing to chase nothing to fight over.   Maybe u are right though and instinctively they would rub and scrape and spar even in absence of females?  

[MGHunter66]

2 hours ago, JHbowhunter said:

No fighting.  Nothing to chase nothing to fight over.

Oh yea, don’t get laid for a couple months and see how tolerant you are  I will defer to Rusty as well for his take but also agree with Lunatic to a point. Everything wants to breed even in the absence of the opposite sex. 

[JHbowhunter]

Oh @Rusty  please help us out here!!!  With 1 to 1 ratio, would bucks seek longer and harder and deeper into the winter, or would they have far less stress because everthing is bred first time around and in short order?

I say the doe population determines that and in the absent of any doe estrous, the rut would stop.  

WHAT SAY YOU????

[Rusty]

Buck's testosterone levels go up around the time that the velvet sheds and goes back down around the time that they drop their antlers.  So basically they are ready to breed from velvet shed to antler drop.  But it takes a hot doe to get them going crazy.  For example, they are pretty chill throughout December but as soon as a doe fawn comes into estrus in the middle of January the bucks go crazy.  

So to answer your question,  if there are a lot of bucks competing for the does the rut will be short and crazy with a lot of competition between bucks.  If there are less bucks then you won't see the crazy competition between bucks and the rut will be more dragged out.   

[SPEARFISH]

Just because they breed the does the first time around does not mean they all get pregnant.  There will always be a secondary or tertiary rut.

[Lunatic]

20 hours ago, JHbowhunter said:

I punt that one to Rusty. I thought I read that does drive the rut the bucks just respond accordingly. Put 20 bucks  in a 250 acre high fence with zero exposure to females. Not a whiff.  My theory is they would not make scrapes  and only rub to remove velvet. No fighting.  Nothing to chase nothing to fight over.   Maybe u are right though and instinctively they would rub and scrape and spar even in absence of females?  

Zero exposure to female is different. IMO a buck with raised testosterone, unable to find doe in heat, will check every one he encounters.   Again, who knows, that's what I am thinking.
I was a young buck once and did not need receptive female to initiate the chaise

[JHbowhunter]

57 minutes ago, Rusty said:

Buck's testosterone levels go up around the time that the velvet sheds and goes back down around the time that they drop their antlers.  So basically they are ready to breed from velvet shed to antler drop.  But it takes a hot doe to get them going crazy.  For example, they are pretty chill throughout December but as soon as a doe fawn comes into estrus in the middle of January the bucks go crazy.  

So to answer your question,  if there are a lot of bucks competing for the does the rut will be short and crazy with a lot of competition between bucks.  If there are less bucks then you won't see the crazy competition between bucks and the rut will be more dragged out.   

@Lunatic what do I win?????

Edited November 7, 2019 by JHbowhunter

[Lunatic]

1 hour ago, JHbowhunter said:

@Lunatic what do I win?????

 

[Slayer1962]

I have seen more deer this year than in many years i can remember. I passed no less than 7 deer first day. It seemed like a steady parade. Same area I hunted the last few years  

[Lunatic]

11 minutes ago, Slayer1962 said:

I have seen more deer this year than in many years i can remember. I passed no less than 7 deer first day. It seemed like a steady parade. Same area I hunted the last few years  

Same here

[megavites]

12 minutes ago, Lunatic said:

I have seen more deer this year than in many years i can remember. I passed no less than 7 deer first day. It seemed like a steady parade. Same area I hunted the last few years 

Same here

same here. 3 big buck encounters so far this year within shooting range.