ECollar training

[FowlHooked]

I recently purchased a Sportdog 425 Wetland Hunter to begin reinforcing obedience training with my 8 month old lab. This is my first time training a dog for waterfowl. Anyway, after letting her spend time wearing the collar during training i attempted to use it for the first time today.

 

After setting her level to where I didnt get much more then a head turn (level 2) i began with heel work. The first time I hit it she yelped and cowered. I lowered the transmitter to 1 and she had the same response.

 

Wondering if anyone else is familiar with this collar? It only has a medium and a high setting where other models have a low and medium. Is the collar too strong or is she being hypersensitive?

 

Open to any suggestions. This is my first time doing this.

 

Im really baffled because she was fine initially when i set it and then had this response once we began working.

[Rdfhunter]

IMO , you have to get her to understand why the feeling happened .. after you correct her with it you have to just immediately move forward withbwhat ever exercises you are doing as if nothing happened .She’ll get the hang of it ... I have and always will say this .. never use a setting on your dog you haven’t first used on yourself .

[gillripper]

The dog should not be yelping from the collar. Be careful. Dogs have been ruined by over stimulation. Does anyone he collar have an audible tone prior to stimulation? Once my dog hears that tone she knows to follow a command b/c she knows the shock is coming.

[Gruntinbuck]

Where do you live if I can ask? If you are close I can help you out. I live in cinnaminson.

[FowlHooked]

I think your right on point RDF. I used the device on myself and could barely feel it. I think ill start her with the vibrate function to condition her further before going back to stimulation (i should of did that in the first place probably].

 

Also, if anyone from SJ area knows of a lab club that trains frequently in SJ please PM me. Id like to have more knowledgeable people to work with in the spring and maybe get her to junior hunt test.

Edited January 2, 2018 by FowlHooked

[thefirstndsecond]

There is a retriever club that meets at colliers mills.

 

You should make sure your dog knows the command before you ever introduce the e collar.

 

The e collar is only an extension of the leash.

 

I almost ruined my dog with a collar before I learned how to use it.

 

You should put it away until you have someone there with you.

[Pucknut]

Agreed, dont subject your dog to a level you haven’t experienced. I use a dogtra super x. It has a pager function which just is a slight vibration to let the dog know it is on. I will usually use that before a higher level. Is it possible the collar could be too tight? I think the E collars are a good tool if used correctly. Good luck!

[MGHunter66]

Remember the collar is an aid not a substitute. Ever hear the saying you get more with sugar than salt. Most of your obedience training should be hands on, for example. Command your dog to sit, if she doesnt physically(gently) put her in the sit position saying sit again while you are doing it. If she stays sitting pet and praise lavishly, if she doesnt repeat with a quick buzz from the collar and physically sit her again. You want her to listen to you not the collar, the collar is just reinforcement of your command until she “gets it” and soley listens to commands without needing the buzz. Sorry i am not a fan of shocking dogs for training, using it to stop them from running across a road is one thing but to train basic commands using it is not the answer in my opinion. A dog responds and repeats actions better when taught with physical intervention and praise than with negative impulses like being shocked. Some dogs will actually shut down with ecollar training, i have seen this first hand with spaniels. Keep your training sessions short yet frequent and you’ll get best results. Training treats help alot, especially if you don’t give a treat everytime they do something right, only every other or third time. They want the treat and will follow commands readily once they learn what the command is asking them to do, thats our part to physically put them into position while giving the command. Buy the book “ Hup, training flushing spaniels the american way” i know your dog is a lab but the obedience techniques you’ll learn in this book work for all dogs. Using it my boykin sat, stayed, came in, heeled at pace and retreived in six months flat both to voice and whistle commands, you’ll find whistle commands very helpful afield

[thefirstndsecond]

Navesink River Retriever trains at Colliers and Assumpink

[Gruntinbuck]

Btw I train with a group of guys around whiting. Pm me your number I can give you some info.

[Williemo]

I’m thinking about your situation with heeling. Cannot figure out why an e-collar is needed to teach heel, especially at that age. As Maximus said, you get more with sugar. Put the collar away. Try using thin slices of hot dogs and you can get your dog to do amazing things! There’s two things to remember 1) An 8 month old “any dog” just wants to please the hell out of you. 2) YOU are the monkey...if you are offering treats, the dog tries to figure out how to get the monkey to give him a treat! 3) Collars should be used sparingly and are used to correct ONLY when the dog fully understands your commands.

 

I’m not going to go through specifics as this YouTube clip covers all you should need to do. https://youtu.be/kQpkJFqHKT8. Watch it and then come back to this.

There are a couple things I like about this video. The dog knows very well where the treats are (that’s why the smell of hot dogs are so awesome!) The trainer is “powerloading”. Every time the dog is at a “near heel position”, she clicks and treats. I am a fan of clickers. Trues, you can say “good” and treat, but personally, the clicker is an impartial, impersonal indicator to the dog that it did something right. It’s quick, and there is no intonation difference be it you, your wife, kids or whomever is working with the dog.

Back to the video, as the dog gets familiar with the required positioning to get a treat, the trainer stops giving treats on every occasion, kind of keeping the dog guessing whether he is going to get a treat or not. Once the trainer knows the dog “gets it”, she can treat or not treat at will. Eventually she throws in the sit command. Clearly the dog already knows sit but does not do so automatically. Yet the trainer does not repeat the command if the dog does not sit, she just waits. The dog damn well knows what sit is and heard it the first time...the trainer gives no breaks. When you are certain the dog knows the command, don’t repeat it! Wait it out if you have to! The dog eventually gives in, sits and is rewarded. Thus, the dog figured out what it takes to get the monkey to give it a treat! But now YOU are in command. The dog knows it needs to sit ASAP if it wants a treat. Eventually treats are not needed (but not a bad idea to throw a bone now and then!)

 

Collars have their places. I used it to teach my dog to not run across the street. If she breaks off of whoa, she gets a little tag. If I know she understands sit and she gets up from sitting; she gets a little tag. However at eight months old, the dog is learning and it is your job to teach it, not penalize for something it does not understand. Building a foundation of basic rules, I very rarely have to use the collar at home or in the field. In fact, I use the vibrate function only as a tool to call her if she is out of earshot. Like heel, I taught her that the vibrate means “come to my side”. I have a very happy dog who wants to please me. Labs are exceptionally biddable dogs, so this should be cakewalk! Teach it well and you should rarely have to use to collar.

[Ducken]

First thing to do is put it away and don’t use it again until you can be shown how and when to use it. As was stated in the other thread, you can ruin a dog real fast with an e-collar. At 8 months old there is no reason for a collar to be used for obedience.  Sit, stay come or here, down, heal should be done by repetition, repetition, repetition.

Look into Navesink retriever club. They hold training sessions where you will get some good help with training your pup. They are a great group of dedicated trainers and hunters.

A few things to remember, never give your dog a command that you can’t reinforce, either at home or training. You must be consistent. Also, the punishment must fit the crime. With obedience just raising or changing your voice tone is enough for most retrievers. Short training sessions, 15 min a day will go a long way. Dogs don’t have memory like us. Always leave on a happy note.

Good luck..................

[birddogger]

Fowlhooked-

 

I train pointers, not retrievers, but what you want to do is pretty much the same for both.

 

The dog may be "over reacting" to the stim, probably because it was already sensitized ,  but that doesn't really matter. 

 

I would start the heel work using a Smith "wonder lead".  It is a much lower pressure tool and the dog will quickly learn how to turn the pressure off.  If you do not know how to use this "wonder lead" ... there should be videos out there, or get someone to show you. 

 

Once the dog is heeling well with the wonder lead, you can overlay and then substitute the e-collar.  The wonder lead will have conditioned the dog to accept the neck as a point of contact, and to understand how to turn off the pressure... making the transition fairly smooth.

 

RayG

 

 

[JHbowhunter]

 I have been wondering if a e-collar would help correct my 3 year old Lab's abhorrent behavior / high anxiety in car....  I have tried everything.   Once the jeep starts moving he barks, whines, paces, can't sit still. He will bark right through his bark muzzle too.   It's difficult to drive anywhere with him - always much better on ride home especially if he gets a good work out.  He thinks every trip he is going swimming or bird hunting, and just is so over-anxious it's disturbing...    He projectile sheds the entire time due to his high anxiety - you can imagine what inside of my Jeep GC looks like!

[MGHunter66]

I have been wondering if a e-collar would help correct my 3 year old Lab's abhorrent behavior / high anxiety in car.... I have tried everything. Once the jeep starts moving he barks, whines, paces, can't sit still. He will bark right through his bark muzzle too. It's difficult to drive anywhere with him - always much better on ride home especially if he gets a good work out. He thinks every trip he is going swimming or bird hunting, and just is so over-anxious it's disturbing... He projectile sheds the entire time due to his high anxiety - you can imagine what inside of my Jeep GC looks like!

Thats a tough one Jack. I would take the anticipation away by getting in the truck with him, as soon as he starts barking stop, say no and get out of the truck with him until he stops. Once calm, put him back in and repeat the process. It may take quite a few sessions and you may only get a couple hundred yards in total but it may be just what it takes