When is it Enough Rain ?

[1957Buck]

Paterson Falls top photo Really Roaring this morning from last rain bottom last week. They even have the Floodgates open In pump house. More Heavey rain for Friday and next week, with opening day Trout just 9 days away Many River and streams are at or above Flood stage The Morris and Sussex could not find any info. This could cancel stocking as it did it past years. but the Trucks have been out already. Guess will be Lake fishing opening day. Anyone have an eye on upstate Rivers and streams? 

[Bucksnbows]

"At or above flood stage"???  We're not even remotely close to flood stage up north.  The trout stocking is ongoing, but was delayed last week in some places due to snow.  Neither Point Mountain TCA nor the Ken Lockwood Gorge No-Kill could be stocked.  I believe both are now slated for tomorrow.  

 

The Musky is flowing this morning at 500 cfs. Normal for today is about 300 cfs and flood stage on that river is 3,000 cfs, so high but already falling and a long way from flood stage.  Bankfull for the Musky is about 1,200 cfs and it won't spill over the banks until about 3,000 cfs, lower in certain areas.  

 

Pequest this morning is at 462 cfs and falling.  Normal for today is about 250 cfs, so again, high but nowhere near flood stage or even bankfull.

 

South Branch Raritan is at 276 cfs this morning and normal is about 175 cfs.  Flood stage is about 2,000 cfs on that river for that gauge.  

 

I think we have gotten so used to extremely low flows that now that we are beginning to see normal flows once again, we feel they are high and flooding.  Not so.  And our groundwater supplies remain very low overall for most of NJ's trout country (northwest NJ).  Flows will drop all day today and tomorrow before coming back up on Friday and Saturday with the next round of rains, but I wouldn't expect any flooding.  So long as the stocking trucks can drive over bridges, they can stock trout.  And so far there are absolutely no issues with any of that.  It's just those wet places like the trails of Point Mountain or the dirt road along the KLG that are problematic.   

[rgw]

I been crying for water since january. we need it and bad. unfortunately the south branch will drop as quick as it goes up because they are or were pumping it into rv. it killed my trapping all year, finding a spot to set and keep a 6" trap was tough.

[1957Buck]

"At or above flood stage"???  We're not even remotely close to flood stage up north.  The trout stocking is ongoing, but was delayed last week in some places due to snow.  Neither Point Mountain TCA nor the Ken Lockwood Gorge No-Kill could be stocked.  I believe both are now slated for tomorrow.  

 

The Musky is flowing this morning at 500 cfs. Normal for today is about 300 cfs and flood stage on that river is 3,000 cfs, so high but already falling and a long way from flood stage.  Bankfull for the Musky is about 1,200 cfs and it won't spill over the banks until about 3,000 cfs, lower in certain areas.  

 

Pequest this morning is at 462 cfs and falling.  Normal for today is about 250 cfs, so again, high but nowhere near flood stage or even bankfull.

 

South Branch Raritan is at 276 cfs this morning and normal is about 175 cfs.  Flood stage is about 2,000 cfs on that river for that gauge.  

 

I think we have gotten so used to extremely low flows that now that we are beginning to see normal flows once again, we feel they are high and flooding.  Not so.  And our groundwater supplies remain very low overall for most of NJ's trout country (northwest NJ).  Flows will drop all day today and tomorrow before coming back up on Friday and Saturday with the next round of rains, but I wouldn't expect any flooding.  So long as the stocking trucks can drive over bridges, they can stock trout.  And so far there are absolutely no issues with any of that.  It's just those wet places like the trails of Point Mountain or the dirt road along the KLG that are problematic.   

 

Was hoping you would comment Thanks for info. Bill

[Bucksnbows]

The good news for our trout streams so far this spring is we are expecting more moderate rains every few days which is just what the doctor ordered.  The last 2 snowstorms melted slowly.  In fact, we still have some lingering snow on the ground even today, especially all the roadsides and driveway sides where it was plowed or snowblown into berms, and all of that has yet to melt and soak in to the ground.  It will take a wet year to get us back on track with our groundwater which is what keeps our trout waters cold and clean.  Lake Hopatcong hasn't reached full pool in several years.  That may change this year.  God knows the State Parks is doing everything they can to cut back flows into the upper Musky over many of our objections in an effort to keep the marinas happy this year.  That lake is attenuated which means it doesn't have enough watershed to keep it full in summer months.  That's the problem with most man-made lakes.....     

Edited March 29, 2017 by Bucksnbows

[1957Buck]

Monmouth County had torrential rains past 2 days and more of same for Friday. As we are in Spring this is normal. Parts of Tomsriver at the Tree conservation section in Jackson and upper Manasquan have had Stocking canceled due to low water flow as well as flooding. Both sections take days to go normal if there is such a thing if not to just Run Very Muddy for weeks. even if they are stocked it will be very poor fishing. 

[51smd]

Hey bucksnbowis there a website where we can look up these water levels you posted thanks.

[Bucksnbows]

Hey bucksnbowis there a website where we can look up these water levels you posted thanks.

 

Yes, but you need to hover over the dots on the map to find the gauges you want and then bookmark them if you want to find them again easily.  I use an app on my Iphone called River Data and save lots of rivers all over the country for business reasons as well as my local trout streams in PA, NJ and NY for fishing reasons.  Here's the USGS site:

 

https://waterdata.usgs.gov/nj/nwis/rt

 

If you are a big river geek like I am, you can set alarms for email alerts or text alerts (I use text alerts) for high and low flows.  For example, to keep State Parks honest with outflows from Lake Hopatcong into the upper Musky, I set a low flow alert whenever it drops below the agreed to 11.5 cfs.  I also have a 3,000 cfs high flow alert for that river to let me know if it's flooding.  And so on.  

[Bucksnbows]

I should mention that each gauge that is still recording shows flood stage for that gauge on that river.  If you play around, you can find groundwater gauges as well for your area or areas you want to check on.

[Haskell_Hunter]

Yes, but you need to hover over the dots on the map to find the gauges you want and then bookmark them if you want to find them again easily.  I use an app on my Iphone called River Data and save lots of rivers all over the country for business reasons as well as my local trout streams in PA, NJ and NY for fishing reasons.  Here's the USGS site:

 

https://waterdata.usgs.gov/nj/nwis/rt

 

If you are a big river geek like I am, you can set alarms for email alerts or text alerts (I use text alerts) for high and low flows.  For example, to keep State Parks honest with outflows from Lake Hopatcong into the upper Musky, I set a low flow alert whenever it drops below the agreed to 11.5 cfs.  I also have a 3,000 cfs high flow alert for that river to let me know if it's flooding.  And so on.  

 

I follow the Musky cfs like it's my job.  One of the better indicators.  Obviously I need to follow the Wanaque, Ramapo, Pequannock, and Pompton rivers in my neck of the woods.

[JHbowhunter]

I believe we are still in an overall deficit, bring on more rain! If the streams are flooded for opening day, all the better as it spreads them out more and makes for better fishing when the weather is nicer.

[Bucksnbows]

Now just to get down in the weeds on river geek stuff, it helps to know if the river is a pure freestone river, a pure limestone river, or a limestone influenced river.  Knowing those things can help you predict an awful lot about future flows when combined with a decent weather forecast.  For example, the South Branch Raritan, our best of the major trout streams when it comes to wild trout, is a pure freestone river.  That means it flashes up following a rain and then tends to fall nearly straight back down as the runoff enters the river and moves downstream to the ocean.  The Musky and the Pequest, by comparison, are both "limestone influenced" meaning that most of their water comes from rainfall like a freestoner, but they also get a portion of their water from the limestone karst.  These river flash up just like the SBR will, but as they recede, they look more like a bell curve and take much longer as the limestone karst below them acts like a sponge.  So after a big rain, fish the SBR and leave the Musky and Pequest alone except up in their headwaters which will drop more quickly.  Conversely, in low water years, the Musky and Pequest will express more of that limestone karst ground water and will fish better as there will be more water in them.  NJ only really has one true limestoner, and I doubt many here fish it.  That is the Lopatcong Creek which is fairly small by comparison to most other trout streams, at least our major trout streams.  

 

 

[JHbowhunter]

I always thought the headwaters of the Paulinskill were a pure limestoner, especially the source near the old Limestone Quarry. Man when they used to pump that cold crystal clear water out of that quarry, the native brookie fishing back in the bush was unbelievable.

 

My general rule of thumb is fish the Flatbrook after heavy rains, fish the paulinskill days later.

[Bucksnbows]

I always thought the headwaters of the Paulinskill were a pure limestoner, especially the source near the old Limestone Quarry. Man when they used to pump that cold crystal clear water out of that quarry, the native brookie fishing back in the bush was unbelievable.

 

My general rule of thumb is fish the Flatbrook after heavy rains, fish the paulinskill days later.

 

The Paulinskill is like the Pequest and Musky (and Pohatcong Creek) in that it is a limestone influenced river.  But it warms more than the Musky.  The Pequest is a mess in the middle, but that has to do with the heavy channelization it suffered for the sod farms and to rid the area of mosquitoes that brought disease centuries ago.  That river is best below the state hatchery.  With the two lower dams on the P-kill coming out, temps will be better for trout and we will see American shad shoot way upstream one day soon.  The Columbia Lake dam won't do too much for decreased temps because it is only 1,500 feet upstream from the Delaware, but the shad stack up against it each spring,  Once The Nature Conservancy removes it, those shad will run upstream for the first time in nearly 100 years.  But we can't yet fish for them except in the big D.  However, I think we'll see trout anglers hooking some incidentally which the Division knows and is working on for the future.  

 

It was too bad when the quarry shut down at Limekiln on the Paulinskill.  It sure did do great things for the trout fishery in that area. 

[Haskell]

the Wanaque resivoir is still down 6 feet,greenwood lake is finally flowing over again